Tourney Chip race : a player cannot be eliminated by the chip race (1 Viewer)

[Kid_Eastwood]

Hi ,

The are 2 ways to color-up chips :

1. Chip race
2. Rounding up

The advantage of the first one is that it keeps the total number of chips constant during the entire tournament.

There is a rule for the chip race saying that a player cannot be eliminated by the chip race.

So in the improbable event where, when it's the moment to color-up the T25 :
P1 has 50
P2 has 50
All other player have their stack being a multiple of 100.

A. 1 chip of 100 shall be in play during the chip race.
B. But no player can be eliminated by the chip race.

I guess B. prevails on A. in that case and that the chip count will be increased by 100 - at least until the next chip race. Is this correct ?

Kid

 

[Kentucky]

You are correct.

Technically, one of P1 or P2 will win the actual race and get the 100 chip. The other player will get a ‘free’ chip so as not to be eliminated. This is the same as the vanilla case when P1 has 25,050, P2 has 50, and P1 wins the race. P2 gets a free chip and the total count is increased.

This could be why I always round up.

 

[WedgeRock]

The advantage of the first one is that it keeps the total number of chips constant during the entire tournament

Not necessarily. If it's a 2TT and someone moves because of an elimination, chip totals can get skewed at both tables.

 

[Kentucky]

Not necessarily. If it's a 2TT and someone moves because of an elimination, chip totals can get skewed at both table.

Right - one table can be up and another down if say the chip leader moves, but the total for the tournament stays the same.

 

[Beakertwang]

I've done the chip race before, but it's so much easier to round everyone up, and it has a negligible effect on the game.

 

[WedgeRock]

Right - one table can be up and another down if say the chip leader moves, but the total for the tournament stays the same.

Let's say a prayer loses 2xT25 and then gets moved to the other table.

Now neither tables has multiples of 4xT25.

The total at play for the tournament will not be the same after color up.

"But the difference is so small that it doesn't matter."

Exactly. Which is why we round up.

 

[allforcharity]

If you're in danger of being eliminated by a chip race, you've probably got more important things to think about than the chip race.

 

[Frogzilla]

If you're in danger of being eliminated by a chip race, you've probably got more important things to think about than the chip race.

In big blind ante formats it isn’t uncommon for high level players to leave 1 chip behind after their river bet, especially if they get to see a couple more hands for free with full rights to the BBA. The last chip can be worth quite a lot

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Not necessarily. If it's a 2TT and someone moves because of an elimination, chip totals can get skewed at both table.

Indeed but I thought that in this case, the number of chips in play during the chip race would be the same with some rounding.

Ex :
2 tables tourney.
Due to a table move, the number of 25 is not a multiple of 100 on both table.
on table 1 : T25 x 81
on table 2 : T25 x 79

Table 1 chip race
P1 : 2 x 25
P2 : 2 x 25
P3 : 1 x 25

Table 2 chip race
P1 : 1 x 25
P2 : 2 x 25

--> 125 to chip race in table 1 --> introduce 1 x 100
--> 75 to chip race in table 2 --> introduce 2 x 100

Chip count not increased.
1. But I'm not 100% sure we should round the number of chips to introduce.
2. What if the number of odd T25 is 2 (= 50 in value). Do we insert an additonal T100 or not ?

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

I've done the chip race before, but it's so much easier to round everyone up, and it has a negligible effect on the game.

I also round everyone up. But I was just curious about that.

 

[WedgeRock]

1. But I'm not 100% sure we should round the number of chips to introduce.
2. What if the number of odd T25 is 2 (= 50 in value). Do we insert an additonal T100 or not ?

I fought for chip races for a long time. Then I had an epiphany... I doesn't change things enough to matter.

I've rounded up since then.

 

[LeLe]

Now that is 1 more reason to have spare chips for each set.

You actually may need mores chip than needed when chip racing

 

[WedgeRock]

Now that is 1 more reason to have spare chips for each set

Respectfully, I disagree again.

If you need extra T100s because when the T25s are coming off, just introduce a couple T500 and you're GTG.

You do need extra of each denom, just not for rounding.

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Now that is 1 more reason to have spare chips for each set.

You actually may need mores chip than needed when chip racing

The chips needed to cover the worst cases of color-up should not be considered as spares imho but part of the set. That's what I do my all my sets.

Ex.
I've 80 x 25 and 80 x 100 for a STT set.
I plan to color-up the 25 and 100 with 1000.
I've also 60 x 500 that I plan to color-up with 5000.

In total I need to color-up 4000 in chips.
In best case I need 4000 in 1000 (10) and 5000 (6) but to cover the rounding up worst case I multiply 4000 by 1.5 and foresee 6000 (10 x 1000 and 10 x 5000).

 

[WedgeRock]

I use the 35%-65% method.

I color up about 35% of a denom into the next highest denom and 65% into two denoms up.

Say there are 200xT25 on the tables.

• About 35%ish is colored up to T100 chips (in this case, T500-T1000 in value)
• About 65%ish is colored up to T500 chips (here, T3000-T3500 in value)

If your starting stacks have a sufficient amount, you don't need to put too many more on. Especially because stacks will be consolidating as players are eliminated.

I find that coloring up 100% into the next denom makes your set larger than it needs to be, and it also puts too many of the smallest chip in play (the T100 after color up) on the table after the first color-up. And that just makes more work for the second color-up, getting them off the table again.

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Myself, I use to color-up :

T25 by introducing T1000
T100 by introducing T1000
T500 by introducing T5000
T1000 by introducing T25,000

When I say introduce T1000, I mean, the bank changes a T1000 with T100 (and T500 if needed) from the big stack and use them to color-up the T25 from the big stack and other players.

 

[Kentucky]

I try not to add on to the table something I plan to remove later. I guess ymmv depending on starting stacks and Multi-Table-ness.

 

[philhut]

Hi ,

The are 2 ways to color-up chips :

1. Chip race
2. Rounding up

The advantage of the first one is that it keeps the total number of chips constant during the entire tournament.

There is a rule for the chip race saying that a player cannot be eliminated by the chip race.

So in the improbable event where, when it's the moment to color-up the T25 :
P1 has 50
P2 has 50
All other player have their stack being a multiple of 100.

A. 1 chip of 100 shall be in play during the chip race.
B. But no player can be eliminated by the chip race.

I guess B. prevails on A. in that case and that the chip count will be increased by 100 - at least until the next chip race. Is this correct ?

Kid

My solution to this problem was to offer a "add-on" option at the first break/color up usually for the equivalent of the initial chip stack buy in thus theoretically doubling up. At most games a majority of players would add-on boosting the pot. With rebuys playing in up until this point some of the pots could grow significantly.

As a player I personally hate the chips race and can not remember winning a chip race ever in my life. Thus I would do my best to eliminate 25's close to color up time and bet larger chips in lieu for blinds etc as needed to try and avoid it. If on the other hand I knew chips would just be rounded up I would always preserve a single quarter to gain 4x return at color up time. Same goes for 5's if that is the tourney base chip etc..

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

If on the other hand I knew chips would just be rounded up I would always preserve a single quarter to gain 4x return at color up time. Same goes for 5's if that is the tourney base chip etc..

Will it then make you more relunctant to call a bet that would make your last 25 go away ?

 

[philhut]

Will it then make you more relunctant to call a bet that would make your last 25 go away ?

tough to say, depends how many hands are left and how much "salsa" I have had up to that point.

 

[buzzmonkey]

Let's say a prayer loses 2xT25 and then gets moved to the other table.

I like this. We should use thoughts and prayers to determine who gets to stay and who gets eliminated.