Can we talk about shipping insurance, and who's liable for loss or damage (2 Viewers)

[Thomacetti]

Well reading all this…I’m just happy for 2 things

1. Blessed with the fact that all my in & out shipments got delivered (sometimes borderline but still…) and +10k chips are safe in the house
2. I have fantastic friends in US that shipped and reshipped without asking (and obv. I would take the loss) but bombproof packaging and the effort to fill in papers as good as possible (incl customs documents) has 100% attributed to my win rate.

And regarding insurance…that is almost not possible since VAT will be calculated on the insured amount (close to 30%).
So taking in account the shipping, PP fees and conversion, the horrible EUR - dollar, VAT and customs fees and local post fees…I’m currently paying at least 50% (yes five o) overhead on every purchase.

Please let that sink in next time you post CONUS only

 

[Machine]

Disagree, if by ”full responsibilty” you mean responsible to reinburse buyer for shipments that have gone missing.

Well thankfully we are reasonable adults and if I buy from you or you me, we'll be explicit in our expectations

So I ship something per instructions from a buyer, and then get a message that says, "well, it didn't make it here on time, and now I'm on a 2-week vacation. Box is on my porch, maybe a neighbor can pick it up, we'll see".

Still seller's responsibility? Full stop? Nothing in this topic is full stop.

No, I foolishly assumed 'both parties were acting in good faith', with my statement.

I mean, I realize that this was an exaggerated example. But I've had something very similar happen as a seller, and it feels pretty helpless. I'm just trying to say that I don't think there is a black/white here -- it's situation dependent. There is no full stop.

I think there is a clear line of responsibility; If the seller or shipper damages or loses the package the risk should be assumed by the seller. The buyer has no ability to be reimburse via the shipper.

Delivery being the demark may have some grey area, but I think that can be navigated logically, and risk can be reduced.

I would say, in hindsight the seller should have asked for a signature, unless explicitly requested to not have a signature. I'll point out that trusting the buyer would say something would have played into this, hence 'hindsight'. The buyer should have requested signature, or at least mentioned they were on a schedule. It sounds like the buyer wasn't overly concerned about the money, and openly took the risk.

High value goods, both the seller and buy should be acting in good faith, going on holiday when rare or custom items are in route and you know that, isn't good faith.

Expecting goods to not be stolen from your house during an extended leave, say like going to work for the day, also isn't good faith.

In Darson's post, the shipper was to blame, and the responsibility was between the seller and shipper; the buyer shouldn't have been charged. I'm glad it had a not super bad ending.

 

[Machine]

I recently argued with urgent care staff about whether or not I needed an ambulance to go to the ER in the next town over. I lost. Can't wait to see the bill for the ambulance ride, and whether or not it's covered. Good times!

My daughter broke her arm, we went to the hospital, they explained all they could do was give her Fentanyl and send her to the children's hospital. I expected an ambulance, but they said I could take her. Got lucky on that one I suppose, of course she had to have surgery and me being me looking up any complications and risk, I found the mortality rate was something like 1.4% on kids and the anesthetics; so that was a fun like 36 hours of obsessive worrying.

 

[Seeking Alpha Social Club]

Curiosity questions for peeps that think it's on the seller/shipper.

Does that apply for international shipping as well?

I ask because I have received packages where Customs opened the package and literally left a good portion of the contents laying of the floor somewhere (because it weren't in the box), and the part they did put back in was partially damaged.

 

[upNdown]

Curiosity questions for peeps that think it's on the seller/shipper.

Does that apply for international shipping as well?

I ask because I have received packages where Customs opened the package and literally left a good portion of the contents laying of the floor somewhere (because it weren't in the box), and the part they did put back in was partially damaged.

It’s hugely stressful to ship internationally and I guess since I (as the seller) feel responsible, that’s why I hate doing it.

That was a bad sentence

 

[MrWitti]

I think we‘ve seen many of these threads. Maybe worth make it a mandatory field when posting a new sales ad. Whoever agrees to the deal, the terms of the deal are defined.

 

[Eriks]

Well thankfully we are reasonable adults and if I buy from you or you me, we'll be explicit in our expectations

Naturally. And I hope I don’t come off as a slimey, no good, piece of shit seller looking to dodge any responsibility. I’m probably more so a buyer than a seller here (although I have plenty of sales under my belt) when adding everything up, but when I do sell I always pack my shit as if nuclear war was upon us.

Nothing of mine ever got lost, however, neither going from nor coming here. Maybe I’d have a different perspective if I’d gotten burnt a few times, I don’t know.

 

[Highli99]

I give my post office delivery person a Christmas card with $100 every year. My packages are put in my screened in porch and I've never had any issues. I consider that my best insurance possible as a frequent buyer. Plus it's a nice thing to do for the GOAT usps employee I've ever encountered.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

My daughter broke her arm, we went to the hospital, they explained all they could do was give her Fentanyl and send her to the children's hospital. I expected an ambulance, but they said I could take her. Got lucky on that one I suppose, of course she had to have surgery and me being me looking up any complications and risk, I found the mortality rate was something like 1.4% on kids and the anesthetics; so that was a fun like 36 hours of obsessive worrying.

1.4% mortality was many decades ago.

Also @Josh Kifer you’re very fortunate to have had those symptoms with that kind of timing and recovery of functionality. The typical window is often hours to 1-2 days.

 

[Machine]

Naturally. And I hope I don’t come off as a slimey, no good, piece of shit seller looking to dodge any responsibility. I’m probably more so a buyer than a seller here (although I have plenty of sales under my belt) when adding everything up, but when I do sell I always pack my shit as if nuclear war was upon us.

Nothing of mine ever got lost, however, neither going from nor coming here. Maybe I’d have a different perspective if I’d gotten burnt a few times, I don’t know.

not at all Happy to buy from or sell to you brother!

I think when a seller does everything they can it shows, and I think when buyers don't give a shit, it shows.

James and Mel both ship more often the most, and the level of effort they put in makes someone's day. I have learned from this thread and at the end of the day I hope it saves someone headache.

 

[Darson]

And regarding insurance…that is almost not possible since VAT will be calculated on the insured amount (close to 30%).
So taking in account the shipping, PP fees and conversion, the horrible EUR - dollar, VAT and customs fees and local post fees…I’m currently paying at least 50% (yes five o) overhead on every purchase.

That reminds me - my buddy had to pay Parcel Force the tax plus their fees before they would deliver the shoes he never received. And then had to spend more time trying to get a refund. He succeeded eventually...

 

[bergs]

Well reading all this…I’m just happy for 2 things

1. Blessed with the fact that all my in & out shipments got delivered (sometimes borderline but still…) and +10k chips are safe in the house
2. I have fantastic friends in US that shipped and reshipped without asking (and obv. I would take the loss) but bombproof packaging and the effort to fill in papers as good as possible (incl customs documents) has 100% attributed to my win rate.

And regarding insurance…that is almost not possible since VAT will be calculated on the insured amount (close to 30%).
So taking in account the shipping, PP fees and conversion, the horrible EUR - dollar, VAT and customs fees and local post fees…I’m currently paying at least 50% (yes five o) overhead on every purchase.

Please let that sink in next time you post CONUS only

I never post CONUS only.

But I do post CONUS4LIIIIIIFE

 

[JoeBGo]

Interesting…

As a seller, I feel it’s my responsibility to offer insurance and the buyers preferred shipping method at THEIR cost unless otherwise stated. It’s also my responsibility to package extremely well to avoid damage.

As a buyer, if I’m buying something expensive I’ll ask for insurance. Otherwise I’d expect the seller to package well and at least provide tracking.

I guess in any future sales ads I’ll need to add wording, because if a package is lost I don’t feel like that’s the sellers problem. They buyer should be paying for insurance if they feel like they may need it.

 

[upNdown]

I generally build insurance (and shipping) into the price of a sale. Kudos to you if you want to pay for that part of the expense of the exchange. I put that expense on the buyer. It is a sellers duty to send the chips, for sure. But, once you give them over to a shipper you relinquish control and it’s now on the shipper to execute that service. Which was also paid for by someone. Which begs the question, do you also pay for shipping or make the buyer pay for that?

Interesting question, but it’s really just a terms of sale thing. Who pays for what?

I guess I agree that anything can be a terms of sale thing. And yeah, build the insurance into the price - that’s fine and it makes sense.
But to me, it’s not enough to say I lost control of the package when I handed it to USPS, so take it up with them. Because regardless of who requested insurance or who paid for the insurance, the shipper is the only one who can put in an insurance claim. The buyer can’t do that. So that’s why it makes sense to me to say that insurance is the shippers responsibility. And so I think it logically follows that the package is the shipper’s responsibility until it’s been delivered.

 

[Josh Kifer]

1.4% mortality was many decades ago.

Also @Josh Kifer you’re very fortunate to have had those symptoms with that kind of timing and recovery of functionality. The typical window is often hours to 1-2 days.

Yup. Had it for 8 weeks. I'm lucky all I got is a limp now.. my Neurosurgeon was shocked I recovered so well. Now twice.