AJs in the blinds, Hero might be a donkey here

DrStrange

Full House
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
4,845
Reaction score
8,603
Location
Outlet Mall in San Marcos
Playing 1-2 live, nine handed. We are early to midway through a normal { for us} session. The table is in a great mood, chips flying everyone laughing. Basically perfect.

Cast of characters:

Hero is in the small blind with $300 on a $500 buy in. It has been a frustrating session, Hero has been stacked twice with a big pair running into unlikely two pair (63s and T4o). Could be Hero is a little tilted, though Hero isn't prone to that fault as much as many would hope.

BB is a tricky trappy, semi-passive, sticky calling station playing $400. He won $1,000 the last session and is a little wilder than normal but still tricky. Mostly his aggression comes a street late - ie might raise KK on a safe flop rather than preflop or a flopped set waits till the turn.

Crazy is UTG+1 with a minty fresh $180. He is spewing chips like mad. Wildly loose, aggressive and very willing to take the worst of it to get a big bet in.

MP is a semi-loose, semi aggressive with $575. This guy is moderately profitable but has been on a multi-month heater which has improved his game. He has made some super sick bluffs the last few months and he is basking in the glow of success.

Our Crafty Old LAG is the button with $900. He is winning nicely for now (though we know the doom switch is coming ) This guy is a marginal winner but can be his own worst enemy at times. If he controlled that fault, Crafty would be formidable.

The hand:

Crazy limps, MP makes it $6 to go {sizing implies a speculative hand like medium pairs, two Broadway cards, suited connectors but he could have AA sometimes}. Crafty calls. This brings the action to Hero with :ad: :jd:. $17 in the pot, $5 to call and BB plus Crazy still to act. Should Hero fold, call or raise? If raising, how much and why?

DrStrange
 

DrStrange

Full House
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
4,845
Reaction score
8,603
Location
Outlet Mall in San Marcos
I have doubts about getting rid of MP with a "reasonable" bet. Maybe a $50 raise would do the trick if he has a speculative hand. {keeping in mind MP was the original raiser}

I think a raise to $25 would push out most of BB's range but $15 isn't enough since $15 is often the normal opening raise anyway.

And let's not forget the RIO problems with AJ. You are never quite sure to root for hitting the ace or the jack . . . . .

DrStrange
 

atomiktoaster

Full House
Joined
Jun 19, 2014
Messages
2,818
Reaction score
1,387
Location
TX
After reading enough of these threads, I'm tempted to make it $31. If you can end up with Crazy and no more than one other villain before the flop, I think you're +EV for the hand.
 

courage

Full House
Joined
Oct 29, 2014
Messages
4,257
Reaction score
6,519
Similar to my weekly game with a few of these characters lol... nobody is folding pf so no way I'm raising oop unless it's a monster. (Two weeks ago I 3bet to $80 pf with AAK in Crazy Pineapple and got 5 callers. /threadjack). Would rather call here, and the raise from Crazy that's coming and play for value. If we're lucky, Crazy raises huge and we can think of isolating but will have to be effectively all in. Edges in this game are too good to be flipping so I don't like that plan too much either.
 

fish72s

Flush
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
1,667
Reaction score
1,530
Location
Central Florida
this. you really don't want to play a bloated pot OOP with AJs imo.

When I first read this thread a hour ago I was going to say exactly this, but I figured I would wait and quote someone else that would say it much more eloquently and succinctly so that I would not have to type so much because I have a tendency to ramble on and on without really knowing what I want to say....squirrel !.
Basically AJ sucks OOP in multiway pots. A few weeks ago I think I actually folded AJo in the blinds to a standard raise and 4 callers and I was playing about 25 BBs. But I digress...
 

DrStrange

Full House
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
4,845
Reaction score
8,603
Location
Outlet Mall in San Marcos
*** on to the flop ***

Hero concurs with not playing a higher SPR hand with AJ from the blinds. Hero limps, BB and Crazy folds. {yup, I was not expecting that either} Three way action, $20 in the pot.

Flop is: :8d: :5s: :3d:

Action on Hero, bet or check, if betting how much? What is Hero's plan?

DrStrange
 

courage

Full House
Joined
Oct 29, 2014
Messages
4,257
Reaction score
6,519
Bet $15. Hero is small favorite over most pairs and can barrel turn and perhaps river on almost any card except joker and instructions.
 

Ben

Full House
Joined
Oct 29, 2014
Messages
2,530
Reaction score
2,722
Location
"The Sticks"
Bet $15. Hero is small favorite over most pairs and can barrel turn and perhaps river on almost any card except joker and instructions.

^^This, but I'm at least 80% to barrel the instruction card as well. 3-bet if raised. We called from the SB; we can rep a set all day long.
 

fish72s

Flush
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
1,667
Reaction score
1,530
Location
Central Florida
This is one of the side benefits of flat calling. Since we didn't narrow our range by raising preflop out of the blinds, we can represent almost anything and we can play this flop hard. We aren't really afraid of any hands except a set. I'm with Ben, bet strong on all streets, hit or miss (maybe a little smaller if we hit the nut flush.
 

Mental Nomad

Full House
Joined
Nov 7, 2014
Messages
3,640
Reaction score
2,452
Location
NJ - NY/NJ metro area
I'm concerned about Crafty. He's here for a reason.

I'm inclined to check, hoping for a small c-bet from MP - then I can see Crafty make his move, or I can check-raise. A check-raise signals a set better than betting out strong.

If it checks around, I'm ok...Checking the flop to the raiser and then betting the turn can imply a missed attempt to check-raise - but it would be a shame if the turn card came for free and it was actually a diamond, which might make it hard to get paid off.
 
Joined
Nov 6, 2014
Messages
157
Reaction score
31
Location
Birmingham, England
Crafty's here because he's on the button deep stacked in a likely 5-way pot and it costs him almost nothing. Can't see any reason to credit him with a hand as yet.
I don't donk much, but definitely think we should bet out here. Check-raising is awkward with our stack size OOP whereas 3-betting lets us commit and we have plenty of FE.
 

DrStrange

Full House
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
4,845
Reaction score
8,603
Location
Outlet Mall in San Marcos
*** Ok now what ***

Hero checks, MP bets $15 and crafty folds. Action on Hero - fold, call or bet. If betting how much? Hero owes $15 to call and the pot prior to that call is $37.

DrStrange
 

Bloody Marvelous

3 of a Kind
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
604
Reaction score
590
Location
Gouda, The Netherlands
I'm putting MP on a decent pocket pair. Probably Tens or Jacks. With a pot sized bet on both rounds, I think we just call here. If the diamond comes we can check, and let MP do the betting for us.
 
Joined
Nov 6, 2014
Messages
157
Reaction score
31
Location
Birmingham, England
Two choices for me.
Either raise to $30-40 as per Chippy McC's suggestion or
overbet. Either $100 or $131 total & call his shove or shove all turns.
Call, fold & standard size raises all look bad to me.

I lean towards the overbet.
 

Bloody Marvelous

3 of a Kind
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
604
Reaction score
590
Location
Gouda, The Netherlands
If you wanted to bet to know where you were, you should've done it before the flop. Now you don't have a made hand, and are a slight underdog against MP's likely holdings. You should bet or check/call here only if you think you can bet him off the hand. An overbet is suspicious and an overpair or AK/AQ will likely call. The only hands that will fold here are hands you have dominated.
 

courage

Full House
Joined
Oct 29, 2014
Messages
4,257
Reaction score
6,519
Why are we putting villain on Jack's when we hold one? Vs TT or 99 we are 55% to 44% fav, we lose 3 points if he holds a diamond. Vs sets we have 25% equity.

Are we stacking off if 4bet on turn? That depends on villain's typical holdings in this spot. I don't see any nits in the game where this is weighted toward sets so I'm more inclined to push the action. C/R flop to $40.
 

Bloody Marvelous

3 of a Kind
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
604
Reaction score
590
Location
Gouda, The Netherlands
Why are we putting villain on Jack's when we hold one? Vs TT or 99 we are 55% to 44% fav, we lose 3 points if he holds a diamond. Vs sets we have 25% equity.

Are we stacking off if 4bet on turn? That depends on villain's typical holdings in this spot. I don't see any nits in the game where this is weighted toward sets so I'm more inclined to push the action. C/R flop to $40.

You're right, we are probably a slight favorite. In that case I support making a sizeable bet, and reraise if needed.
 

DrStrange

Full House
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
4,845
Reaction score
8,603
Location
Outlet Mall in San Marcos
*** On to the turn ***

Hero doesn't follow anyone's advice, he flats. $52 in the pot and it is heads-up.

Turn: < :8d: :5s: :3d: > :jc:

Action on Hero, check or bet. If betting how much?

DrStrange
 

Bloody Marvelous

3 of a Kind
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
604
Reaction score
590
Location
Gouda, The Netherlands
We've been passive the whole way, and MP has been aggressive the whole way. At this point we're almost guaranteed to have the best hand. The :jc: is a safe card and the only way MP knows this has changed anything is if we suddenly start betting.

We check here, and let MP do what he's been doing on every street sofar. If we think we can get more value on the river we flat call his likely raise, else we reraise.
 

fish72s

Flush
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Messages
1,667
Reaction score
1,530
Location
Central Florida
Interesting. This changes things alot. Its odd, but I would go into check-call mode now.
Most of the time we have the best hand but we aren't going to get paid much when we do.
And if we don't have the best we are going to have to dump a bunch of $$$ into the pot since we have so many outs.
No need to bluff and no need to protect our hand (when its good) and little reason to extract value since it will only clue villain in that he is (if he is) beat.
The nit-fish is back ; check-call and check-call any bet, but hope that villain checks behind.
 
Top Bottom