Cash Game $0.50/$1.00 Cash Game

TKEUofM

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For years we have played a monthly $60 buy in NLHE Tourney. Had some feedback from players that once we can start up again they want to have tourneys every other month and do cash games in between.

I have a 2,000 chip HSI set that I just got (300 fracs, 1,200 - $1s, 400 - $5s, and 80 - $25s, 20 - $100s). Will have max of two tables of 7 players. Min buy in for the cash game will be $50 with a max of $100 to start. Need some help with the betting limits, I don't want the cash game to be no limit, what betting structure do most people use? Is it pot limit, or $1 increments with a max bet? We will probably be rotating through 7 card variations, omaha, hold em, etc.

Appreciate any feedback you have for the best cash betting structure.
 

TKEUofM

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Just curious, why don't you want the cash game to be NL?
Want people to be able to maximize their play time and not always be at risk of going broke too fast. I know it's gambling and someone is going to win and someone is going to lose. But it's more about getting together, hanging out, having some drinks and laughs.
 
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snooptodd

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This sounds like it would be a good $1/$2 limit game. You have enough workhorse chips to make it work. Stud games get a little tricky, as the bring-in should be under $1 so you'd have to have a few fracs in play, and I'd make it a dealer ante of $2-$3 just to keep it simple.
 

Eriks

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Stud games works best as fixed limit, the $1/2 suggestion above looks good. As for texas I would still go with nl but perhaps play $0.25/0.5 instead. Omaha is usually pot limit but in my experience that makes the game play bigger than nl since people will declare ”pot”. Would play that $0.25/0.5 as well
 

mike32

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Right up the street we usually play NL Holdem but pot limit Omaha variants. We do .25/.50 blinds with a $60 or $100 buy in. I imagine pot limit would work fine for Holdem as well.
 

upNdown

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Right up the street we usually play NL Holdem but pot limit Omaha variants. We do .25/.50 blinds with a $60 or $100 buy in. I imagine pot limit would work fine for Holdem as well.
I have very little PLHE experience online and none live, so, grain of salt. But it’s been my experience with every other pot limit game I’ve played live or online, that pot limit gets more expensive than no limit. People love to say “pot motherf*cker” and then they get called or repotted and suddenly people are pot committed and the chips go in.
TL;DR - forget pot limit. Try fixed.
Good luck
 

TKEUofM

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I have very little PLHE experience online and none live, so, grain of salt. But it’s been my experience with every other pot limit game I’ve played live or online, that pot limit gets more expensive than no limit. People love to say “pot motherf*cker” and then they get called or repotted and suddenly people are pot committed and the chips go in.
TL;DR - forget pot limit. Try fixed.
Good luck
I can see that happening easily in our group, someone gets excited and yells out pot without realizing how much that will actually cost them. lol
 

detroitdad

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For years we have played a monthly $60 buy in NLHE Tourney. Had some feedback from players that once we can start up again they want to have tourneys every other month and do cash games in between.

I have a 2,000 chip HSI set that I just got (300 fracs, 1,200 - $1s, 400 - $5s, and 80 - $25s, 20 - $100s). Will have max of two tables of 7 players. Min buy in for the cash game will be $50 with a max of $100 to start. Need some help with the betting limits, I don't want the cash game to be no limit, what betting structure do most people use? Is it pot limit, or $1 increments with a max bet? We will probably be rotating through 7 card variations, omaha, hold em, etc.

Appreciate any feedback you have for the best cash betting structure.

Our betting style is dependent on what games were playing. I do .25/.50 dealers choice. Buy in is 60 to 100. Rebuys are 100 or half the deep stack. In a dealers choice round we mostly play pot limit games. If a NL game gets called then we play NL for that orbit.

We also occasionally play fixed limit. I do 3/6 with uncapped buy in (I usually buy in for 500). I prefer not mixing Fixed limit with NL and PL.
 

detroitdad

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I have very little PLHE experience online and none live, so, grain of salt. But it’s been my experience with every other pot limit game I’ve played live or online, that pot limit gets more expensive than no limit. People love to say “pot motherf*cker” and then they get called or repotted and suddenly people are pot committed and the chips go in.
TL;DR - forget pot limit. Try fixed.
Good luck

I couldn't disagree. Fixed limit hold'em sounds like a nightmare.

If the jackasses don't realize what's happening if they say "pot, re pot, all in" then either they are idiots, or their education of the betting style is lacking.
 

upNdown

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I couldn't disagree. Fixed limit hold'em sounds like a nightmare.

If the jackasses don't realize what's happening if they say "pot, re pot, all in" then either they are idiots, or their education of the betting style is lacking.
Let’s be clear, because I think you have more experience with live pot limit than me.
It’s not about what you think about fixed limit, and it’s not about what you think about people who may or may not play stupidly, it’s just one question -
In your experience, which games play bigger, pot limit or no limit?
 

Legend5555

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For years we have played a monthly $60 buy in NLHE Tourney. Had some feedback from players that once we can start up again they want to have tourneys every other month and do cash games in between.

I have a 2,000 chip HSI set that I just got (300 fracs, 1,200 - $1s, 400 - $5s, and 80 - $25s, 20 - $100s). Will have max of two tables of 7 players. Min buy in for the cash game will be $50 with a max of $100 to start. Need some help with the betting limits, I don't want the cash game to be no limit, what betting structure do most people use? Is it pot limit, or $1 increments with a max bet? We will probably be rotating through 7 card variations, omaha, hold em, etc.

Appreciate any feedback you have for the best cash betting structure.
Pot limit is not really much smaller than No Limit. And playing 7 card stud Pot Limit is just a recipe for huge pots as there is one more betting round compared to flop games.

If the goal is $50-100 buy in, then $1/$2, $1.50/$3, or $2/$4 fixed limit would likely be best. And your set supports this easily.
 

detroitdad

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Let’s be clear, because I think you have more experience with live pot limit than me.
It’s not about what you think about fixed limit, and it’s not about what you think about people who may or may not play stupidly, it’s just one question -
In your experience, which games play bigger, pot limit or no limit?

I love both PL and FL. FL HL sounds horrible (only played it once).

With the same stakes/buy ins they play about the same within my group. I'm sure every group is different. We are all pretty experienced (not very good lol) at both types of poker.
 

TKEUofM

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I feel like about half of our tourney group won't be interested in cash games. And about half of the normal side game cash players love all of the wild card crazy ass games so I will need to reel them in to more "normal" game variations.

Probably will be some trial and error for the first event or two until we figure out what the group is comfortable with. Just trying to figure out as much as I can ahead of time as they usually look to me for guidance on structure and rulings.
 

detroitdad

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I feel like about half of our tourney group won't be interested in cash games. And about half of the normal side game cash players love all of the wild card crazy ass games so I will need to reel them in to more "normal" game variations.

Probably will be some trial and error for the first event or two until we figure out what the group is comfortable with. Just trying to figure out as much as I can ahead of time as they usually look to me for guidance on structure and rulings.

I have hosted a ton of dealers choice games and games were we had a fixed list of games to be played. When you get close too hosting I'll gladly help out.

When I host dealers choice I always make it clear that I have veto powers. I think I have only used it once. I don't allow any games where you have to declare your hand, match the pot if you lose, wild card games, or games where it takes you 10 fucking minutes to explain how to play it.

If its dealers choice then we do it r x r. If I call Big O. The we play an entire orbit of it +1. I deal the game that I call twice. After I deal it the second time then the next person calls the game.

If its a fixed list of games like HOPE, HOE, or whatever. Then we only play one orbit of it before switching games. The game always changes on the same player.
 

Rhodeman77

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Let’s be clear, because I think you have more experience with live pot limit than me.
It’s not about what you think about fixed limit, and it’s not about what you think about people who may or may not play stupidly, it’s just one question -
In your experience, which games play bigger, pot limit or no limit?

It really depends on the games being played. Comparing No Limit Hold’em and Pot Limit Omaha is comparing apples and oranges.

Omaha games will play bigger than hold’em games of the same stakes no matter what betting style is used. If Omaha was played no limit I would think people would go all-in with their top set a lot more on the flop to deny odds to a wrap or nut flush draw hand.
 

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And playing 7 card stud Pot Limit is just a recipe for huge pots as there is one more betting round compared to flop games.
Indeed.

I 've anyway thought about (without ever having tried) a PL 6-card Stud with just 4 betting rounds and a negligible initial pot (just a small dealer ante, no forced bet - anybody can check from the first round). Thoughts?

Other than that, what kind of chip set could support alternating rounds of NLHE and limit Stud?
Needless to say I (and everybody I know here) are clueless as to how Limit is played.

@Rhodeman77 is right that Omaha is a lot more volatile / explosive, so the "PL" brake is just inadequate.
Admittedly, it can also act as an accelerator instead, out of people's laziness to calculate what the pot really is.

@TKEUofM sorry for the partial hijack; hopefully my questions are of interest to you too.
 

Legend5555

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Indeed.

I 've anyway thought about (without ever having tried) a PL 6-card Stud with just 4 betting rounds and a negligible initial pot (just a small dealer ante, no forced bet - anybody can check from the first round). Thoughts?

Other than that, what kind of chip set could support alternating rounds of NLHE and limit Stud?
Needless to say I (and everybody I know here) are clueless as to how Limit is played.

@Rhodeman77 is right that Omaha is a lot more volatile / explosive, so the "PL" brake is just inadequate.
Admittedly, it can also act as an accelerator instead, out of people's laziness to calculate what the pot really is.

@TKEUofM sorry for the partial hijack; hopefully my questions are of interest to you too.
You can play Mississippi Stud which basically makes 4th and 5th street dealt together thus eliminating one betting round.

Aa far as Limit Structure, I'll use $2/$4 as an example:

Blinds are $1/$2 in flop and draw games.

Your options are:
Fold
Call $2
Raise to $4

After a raise a player can:
Fold
Call $4
Raise to $6

Action continues like this to a predetermined bet cap of usually 4 or 5 bets ($8 or $10), at which point the options become fold or call.

The flop or 1st draw betting round still has betting in increments of $2. On the Turn and River (or 2nd and 3rd draw), the betting is in increments of $4.

In live games, once the pot is heads up, the betting cap is usually removed. So the heads up players can keep raising back and forth. Online, the cap usually remains.

Stud games work similarly with the first two betting rounds being $2 and the last three being $4. Though stud obviously uses an ante and a bring in. In $2/$4 the ante either be .25 or .50 with a bring in between .50-$1.
 

TKEUofM

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You can play Mississippi Stud which basically makes 4th and 5th street dealt together thus eliminating one betting round.

Aa far as Limit Structure, I'll use $2/$4 as an example:

Blinds are $1/$2 in flop and draw games.

Your options are:
Fold
Call $2
Raise to $4

After a raise a player can:
Fold
Call $4
Raise to $6

Action continues like this to a predetermined bet cap of usually 4 or 5 bets ($8 or $10), at which point the options become fold or call.

The flop or 1st draw betting round still has betting in increments of $2. On the Turn and River (or 2nd and 3rd draw), the betting is in increments of $4.

In live games, once the pot is heads up, the betting cap is usually removed. So the heads up players can keep raising back and forth. Online, the cap usually remains.

Stud games work similarly with the first two betting rounds being $2 and the last three being $4. Though stud obviously uses an ante and a bring in. In $2/$4 the ante either be .25 or .50 with a bring in between .50-$1.
Thanks for the detail.

So we would probably be looking at $1/$2 games with a $0.50 small blind and $1 big blind. Or pre-deal ante depending on the game. Probably a good starting point.
 

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FL and NL Hold'em play quite differently, and not all the differences are subtle. In Super System, FLHE and NLHE have their own chapters. IIRC, the big game in Las Vegas between The Corporation (a group of elite poker pros) and Andrew Beal was heads-up high-stakes FLHE (see The Professor, the Banker, and the Suicide King).

NB: In all the home games and meetups that I've played, a player who calls a round of Hold'em in a dealer's choice game will be booed and will lose that round. Almost guaranteed.
 

mike32

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FL and NL Hold'em play quite differently, and not all the differences are subtle. In Super System, FLHE and NLHE have their own chapters. IIRC, the big game in Las Vegas between The Corporation (a group of elite poker pros) and Andrew Beal was heads-up high-stakes FLHE (see The Professor, the Banker, and the Suicide King).

NB: In all the home games and meetups that I've played, a player who calls a round of Hold'em in a dealer's choice game will be booed and will lose that round. Almost guaranteed.
I did just that (called hold 'em) at the pink chip limit game at Jeff's meetup in Chicagoland a few years ago. Last hand of orbit I dealt myself AK suited and Paulo JJ, he stacked me!
 

JScott

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Want people to be able to maximize their play time and not always be at risk of going broke too fast. I know it's gambling and someone is going to win and someone is going to lose. But it's more about getting together, hanging out, having some drinks and laughs.
In my experiences hosting, the best way to maximize play time like you want is to make sure everyone is playing super deep. So If that was my game I'd make it 25c/50c and $100 buy ins. Our game used to be 25c/50c with $20 buy ins (we didn't know better) and there would be a tonne of all ins and lots of rebuys. I switched it to 25c/25c or 25c/50c with $50 buy ins and the game is much more chill now. Some nights only 1 guy will get stacked before we break up the game.
 

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If your group is open to fixed limit then that's what I would suggest and 2/4 stakes are probably right.

If your group believes "No limit is the only pure poker" or such nonsense, then you price the max buy in at a point where you know most players are comfortable buying in 2-3 times. If 100 is what most players will risk in a night, then 40 max with either 0.25-0.25 or 0.25-0.50 blinds is my suggestion.

Another option I used to use, but dropped because it wasn't popular is to implement a "hand cap."

Basically instead of capping buy ins, you are capping the amount that can be wagered on a hand u til the players are all in. So take a 0.25-0.50 nl game with a hand cap of 50, if the action is 2 preflop, 6 on the floor, and 10 on the turn, that makes the max 32 on the river.

This would make it impossible for anyone to lose a stack of 100 in a single hand, and no one will lose their entire stack unless they are under the cap.

Just some thoughts, hope it helps.
 
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Jimulacrum

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I second everyone who's recommending that you do limit poker, either $1/2 or $2/4. Limit is a better choice than NL or PL for a group of casual players, easier to manage, more entertaining, and better for keeping your game healthy in the long run.

I'd prefer $2/4 because it's a good level for the $100 buy-in you're planning for, and it keeps you from having to use fracs at all, just $1 chips and $25s (and maybe $100s) for color-ups/rebuys. But if that $100 is the max you expect many of your players to be willing to play with, $1/2 would be a better choice.
 

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We play $2/$4 limit dealer choice. We all buy in for $100. We mostly play 6/7 handed Omaha Hi/Lo. We do occasionally get some Holdem and a few crazy games, but 85% of the time it’s Hi/Lo. If we drop to 4 players, we do Hi only.

We usually play around 5 hours and the big winner on the night is $200/$300 and the big loser around the same. Everyone else basically spends a night out drinking with buddies.
 

warma

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We play $2/$4 limit dealer choice. We all buy in for $100. We mostly play 6/7 handed Omaha Hi/Lo. We do occasionally get some Holdem and a few crazy games, but 85% of the time it’s Hi/Lo. If we drop to 4 players, we do Hi only.

We usually play around 5 hours and the big winner on the night is $200/$300 and the big loser around the same. Everyone else basically spends a night out drinking with buddies.
How many re-buys?
 

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For mixed games, LIMIT is where it's at. @detroitdad his advice is spot on, you should listen to him. If I were to be putting up $100 and had another buyin or two in my pocket, I would want to play 2/4 minimum. If I had $60 and that's it, 1/2 would be a fun night of cards.

For straight holdem, just play NL or tournaments. I LOVE limit holdem, but I realize I am on an island. You just won't find many people willing to play LHE any more.
 
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