The Redneck Poker Card Database v2.0
OK folks, here it is...
Thanks to @Tommy for granting permission to make this a resource.
For those of you that missed the original saga of how this all came to be, here's a link to the whole sordid story...
After that initial post, the "list" kept growing until we ran up against the time limit of being able to edit it. By making it a resource there will be no such future issue. (Thanks again Tommy)
The list is ranked by flex rating from softest to stiffest as per the rating generated by the "Gadget". Or, what I'm renaming "The Flex-O-Meter of Truth".
This pins a number on the relative flex of a playing card. Taking the "flex" of it completely out of the subjective realm and placing it soundly into the objective. Much to the consternation of a certain segment of that species loosely called "Human".
Again, the full story behind the adventure of that quest is in the link above.
Also, if you have any questions/comments feel free to post 'em in the topic linked to above.
Here she is....
|Cartamundi "Casino Branded" / Neder Poker||2.26||.0115"||24||Cel||Linen/Linen|
|Angel - Aristo Club||2.24||.0110"||20.5||PVC||Linen/Smooth|
|Desjgn (Old - Modiano) / Modiano (All Exc. "Platinum" & "Elements")||2.38||.0120"||19.5||Cel||Linen/Linen|
|Cartamundi Casino - Belgium||2.46||.0120"||19.5||Cel||Matte/Matte|
|Copag (All Exc. "Texas Hold'Em" & Belgium)||2.44||.0115"||19||PVC||Matte/Matte|
|Modiano Platinum / Tactic Pro Poker||2.53||.0125"||17||Cel||Linen/Linen|
|Copag Texas Hold'Em / Pokah Wonkah||2.57||.0120"||17||PVC||Linen/Linen|
|Cairo Casino (ltd. edition)||2.47||.0120"||17||Cel||Linen/Linen|
|Cartamundi Casino - USA||2.47||.0120"||17||PVC||Smooth/Smooth|
|Marion Pro / ICE||2.42||.0125"||17||PVC||Matte/Smooth|
|Dal Negro Texas Poker / NTP / Zero||2.57||.0130"||15.5||PVC||Matte/Matte|
|Fournier / Bicycle Prestige(*) / Bee / SunFly Lucky Dragon||2.55||.0125"||15||PVC/Prop(*)||Linen/Linen|
|Modiano Elements / Guild||2.63||.0130"||14||Cel||Linen/Linen|
|Faded Spade 2.0||2.61||.0140"||12||PVC||Grainy/Grainy|
|CLM Texas Hold'Em||2.55||.0135"||11||PVC||Smooth/Coarse|
AVG. CARD WEIGHT: Poker Size Cards. Full deck of 52 cards weighed on a gram scale & result divided by 52.
THICKNESS: Average of 8 measurements taken around the perimiter of all 4 deuces. Rounded to nearest half-thousandth. (0.0005")
FLEX: As measured in degrees on the Flex-O-Meter of Truth (new/unused card)
20 = Soft
17 = Medium Soft
14 = Medium
11 = Stiff
PVC = Polyvinyl Chloride - The stuff your toilet plumbing is made of.
CEL = Cellulose Acetate - The stuff cigarette filters are made of.
(*)PROP = "Proprietary" - Bicycle calls theirs "Duraflex". I call it Bovine Excrement. (BULLSH*T FLAG ALERT - See original post in link above)
FINISH: OK, so this part can be slightly subjective. But, what the hell...
GLOSS: Shiny, & usually very slippery. But they are usually cheap.
SMOOTH: Flat finish with no real apparent texture
MATTE: Another flat finish, but with a slight amount of perceptible texture.
LINEN: A texture you can actually start to readily feel. Most common finish amongst more expensive decks.
GRAINY: Pronounced texture. Feels kind of like the surface of a fine whetstone.
COARSE: A surface so textured it's the 1st thing you notice. Stevie Wonder could immediately pick one out of a pile amongst any other finish on the list. Unique to DalNegro's pricier decks it seems. If I had to describe it, imagine if you clear-coated a piece of 800 grit sandpaper & you'll get the idea.
WHO OWNS WHO?
It's gotten pretty incestuous in the land of playing card production. 10 of what we might consider the "major players" in the land of premium playing cards can now all be traced back, at least in part, to one of just three major producers. With that producer either serving as a "production house" for a certain brand, or owning the brand outright. As I write this update (July 2020) here's what I know & have been able to verify with some certainty.
CARTAMUNDI - Founded 1970
COPAG (1908) - Purchased by Cartamundi in 2005
GRIMAUD (1848) - Purchased by Cartamundi in 2014
USPC (1867) - Purchased by Cartamundi in 2019
. BICYCLE - USPC Brand since 1885
. FOURNIER (1868) - Purchased by USPC in 1986
. KEM (1935) - Purchased by USPC in 2004
. Production House for SUNFLY
MODIANO - Founded 1868
DA VINCI - Produced by, if not wholly owned by Modiano.
Production House for: DESJGN (through 2017), TACTIC Games, & GUILD (printing only)
DAL NEGRO - Founded 1928
NTP - Purchased in 2004
Production House for DESJGN (since 2018), & ZERO
KUO KAU Paper Products Co., Ltd - Taiwan - Founded 1979
Makers of Ritz, Royal, Marion Pro
YANGZHOU JINYI Stationery Co., Ltd. (JSC) - China - Founded 1995 - https://www.gaojipoker.com/
Makers of GYT, Bird, Rungood, Neasyth, G-Club, Teskyer, & pretty much anything else that says "Made in China".
This may not be a complete list. Currently I have no idea where Faded Spade or Bullets, for example, are actually made, & hesitate to render a guess. Even though I'm 99.99% certain about SunFly (Lucky Dragon) & Guild based solely on the results of testing & observation. Scroll down to my personal reviews of those to find out why.
In the linked to topic I have my own personal reviews of some of the late-comers to the list....
Faded Spade 2.0 - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-996251
Piatnik - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-997509
NTP - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-999883
Guild - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1001732
Slowplay/Bird/CLM/Rungood - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1010738
(AKA: Cheapskate Card Shootout)
(Cheapskate addition) Joker - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1102148
Lucky Dragon - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1083972
Trefl - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1123593
Cartamundi "Casino Branded" - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1154573
Cartamundi Casino (USA) - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1163850
(Also: Comparison with Cartamundi Classic & Ace Authentic)
Cairo Casino (ltd. edition) - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1168576
Cartamundi Casino (Belgium) - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1178327
King (Australia) - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1212679
Tactic Pro Poker - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1213490
Angel Aristo Club - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1259955
Modiano Elements - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1299394
Bee - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1301373
ZERO / NTP BlackJack / DalNegro Texas Poker - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1371614
Neder Poker - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1371673
Pokah Wonkah - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1371923
Gemaco Superflex & Monarch - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1372464
COPAG (Belgium vs. Brazil) - https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-redneck-poker-card-database.52229/post-1380917
Personal Favorites: Old Desjgn (Modiano Stock) / Kem / Gemaco Monarch / Cartamundi Casino - Belgium
Until I came across Cartamundi's Belgium-made Casino, only Kem were still available of the other 3 favorites. I really wish more would come along & make a nice soft flexing acetate card that doesn't suffer from Modiano's "Fat Spade Syndrome".
Honorable Mention: Piatnik
My issue with PVC is that to get the flexibility of acetate out of PVC (like Copag) you have to make the base stock so thin that durability becomes an issue. So, Piatnik is as close as you can get if you suffer from an allergy to Kem & the price and/or lack of boxes puts you off Cartamundi Casino.
NOTICE: As always, no Chinese restaurant jokes were told during the testing of any of these cards.