Tourney WPC Juniors Tournament Structure (1 Viewer)

BearMetal

BearMetal

4 of a Kind
Supporter
Joined
May 23, 2019
Messages
5,729
Reaction score
14,133
Location
East Windsor, NJ
My poker club will be running its first ever Juniors tournament next week. Looking for some advice on structure, with the following considerations:
  • 10 player, STT - Online
  • All entrants are between the ages of 7 and 12, with most being between 9 and 11. All have played before with their dads casually and are mostly awful players.
  • I wanted the tournament to run for about 1 hour (these are kids which will not have much attention span)
  • I felt like there should be room for error in the chip stacks and so they can actually play. These are kids after all and don't want to fold 90% of their hands (like they should)
I was thinking a deep stack (10,000 chips) with 10-minute blinds:
  • 10/20
  • 25/50
  • 50/100
  • 100/200
  • 200/400
  • 500/1000
  • 1000/2000
  • 5000/10000
 
Last edited:
I think you may be overthinking this - these kids are not going to have the discipline to last long. A normal regular blind structure will be just fine, as they are all in every other hand anyway because they "know" their hand is the best.
 
Well, I'm trying not to overthink it. Yes they are kids and yes they are going to play every hand. That's why I want a deep stack with low blinds.

Just trying to make sure I structure it for the most fun possible. Having a kid out in 10 minutes is no fun.
 
BearMetal said:
Having a kid out in 10 minutes is no fun.
Click to expand...
You are right, but these are kids so it will inevitably happen. Maybe come up with some kind of rebuy procedure? Let me tell you this one from years back ................

A buddy of mine wanted to teach his 2 sons how to play but couldn't come up with anything because of the constant nonstop busts. Both boys were interested in playing football but in all reality were 2 scrawny bean poles that I questioned if football was a smart move for them. We decided to use physical activity as a rebuy procedure, with it getting progressively harder each rebuy. The amount of push ups and sit ups these kids did rebuying and learning poker bulked them up that summer. They both ended up decent at poker, and one of them got a football scholarship (don't want to give away where as to his privacy) so his education is covered.

A rebuy procedure is the only way to prevent against an early bust out. Think of something fun (like the busted player receives a whipped cream pie in the face) and safe for it.
 
tabletalker7 said:
You are right, but these are kids so it will inevitably happen. Maybe come up with some kind of rebuy procedure? Let me tell you this one from years back ................

A buddy of mine wanted to teach his 2 sons how to play but couldn't come up with anything because of the constant nonstop busts. Both boys were interested in playing football but in all reality were 2 scrawny bean poles that I questioned if football was a smart move for them. We decided to use physical activity as a rebuy procedure, with it getting progressively harder each rebuy. The amount of push ups and sit ups these kids did rebuying and learning poker bulked them up that summer. They both ended up decent at poker, and one of them got a football scholarship (don't want to give away where as to his privacy) so his education is covered.

A rebuy procedure is the only way to prevent against an early bust out. Think of something fun (like the busted player receives a whipped cream pie in the face) and safe for it.
Click to expand...
That's hilarious! So most of these kids have been playing for aa few months at the very least. And they understand that if they push all their chips in, they're out of they lose.

We'll also be there to remind them if a hand gets crazy. That's why I chose deep stack over rebuys. In the beginning they can play every hand because of the low blinds.
 
BearMetal said:
That's hilarious! So most of these kids have been playing for aa few months at the very least. And they understand that if they push all their chips in, they're out of they lose.

We'll also be there to remind them if a hand gets crazy. That's why I chose deep stack over rebuys. In the beginning they can play every hand because of the low blinds.
Click to expand...
Do you have any nondenominational chips? Maybe each stack starts out with 10 of those to get "a coach's opinion" on what to do ...........................
 
tabletalker7 said:
Do you have any nondenominational chips? Maybe each stack starts out with 10 of those to get "a coach's opinion" on what to do ...........................
Click to expand...
Oh, it's online using my Poker Mavens server. Kids will be on zoom Brady-Brunch style.
 
I have no clue how Poker Mavens works (I like online poker just a little bit less than I like a good dogfart) but can you pause it so the kid can grab their phone and call "the coach"?
 
tabletalker7 said:
I have no clue how Poker Mavens works (I like online poker just a little bit less than I like a good dogfart) but can you pause it so the kid can grab their phone and call "the coach"?
Click to expand...
Yes, I can pause it as needed. But there's strictly no coaching allowed. Only watching/heckling.
 
I would strongly consider a strict number of "coach's reviews" just to ensure against "the 10 minute bustout". Just my experience when dealing with kids.
 
Online?!?! That makes my suggestion of cocaine and hookers a moot one.

I think if the real challenge here is to learn them yunggins about the finality of a bust out, you definitely have to let them bust out. This cannot realistically be accomplished in an afternoon. Start with a regular structure (possibly with rebuys), and if they're almost all busting quickly, play again, same structure. After games like this, some will already be catching on. At this point, you can change the structure to make the game longer. Now the contrast in how the game plays out under different structures will make some more lightbulbs go off and there should be clear progress for some.

I think if you could get the bust outs to watch the game to the end, it would be easier to facilitate.


*Disclaimer - Have never raised children
 
Other than preventing against the early bust, having a prize worth fighting for is the only other thing needed for teaching kids. Have fun with this - you don't get these times with your kids often so take advantage of it while you still have it :)
 
tabletalker7 said:
Other than preventing against the early bust, having a prize worth fighting for is the only other thing needed for teaching kids. Have fun with this - you don't get these times with your kids often so take advantage of it while you still have it :)
Click to expand...
Exactly right! All the kids know each other. It's really a social event for them. I'm funding the prizes (gift cards to their store of choice)
  • 1st: $30
  • 2nd: $20
  • 3rd: $15
  • 4th-10th: $7
 
mtl mile end said:
Online?!?! That makes my suggestion of cocaine and hookers a moot one.

I think if the real challenge here is to learn them yunggins about the finality of a bust out, you definitely have to let them bust out. This cannot realistically be accomplished in an afternoon. Start with a regular structure (possibly with rebuys), and if they're almost all busting quickly, play again, same structure. After games like this, some will already be catching on. At this point, you can change the structure to make the game longer. Now the contrast in how the game plays out under different structures will make some more lightbulbs go off and there should be clear progress for some.

I think if you could get the bust outs to watch the game to the end, it would be easier to facilitate.


*Disclaimer - Have never raised children
Click to expand...
It's not really to teach them... It's mostly for social fun with each other. They're taught by us "offline" then go to exercise their skill during the tournament. There are prizes (see above post), so running multiple tournaments isn't an option.

My goal in this thread is to find a blind structure/stack size that allows them to play, makes mistakes, have fun, but not go more than about an hour.
 
BearMetal said:
Exactly right! All the kids know each other. It's really a social effect for them. I'm funding the prizes (gift cards to their store of choice)
  • 1st: $30
  • 2nd: $20
  • 3rd: $15
  • 4th-10th: $7
Click to expand...
One more thing (before I open my Christmas 30 pack of beer) have you considered what the buy-in is so these kids value being in the tournament?
 
tabletalker7 said:
One more thing (before I open my Christmas 30 pack of beer) have you considered what the buy-in is so these kids value being in the tournament?
Click to expand...
I considered that heavily. These kids have lost their whole year. They lost camp, lost school, lost social interactions. They haven't seen each other in 9 months.

In this particular case, I'm eating the cost. It's a fun afternoon for them. If it's a huge success, then we'll consider them putting something in next time (not a full buy-in) but something to let them realize they have to give to get...
 
BearMetal said:
I considered that heavily. These kids have lost their whole year. They lost camp, lost school, lost social interactions. They haven't seen each other in 9 months.

In this particular case, I'm eating the cost. It's a fun afternoon for them. If it's a huge success, then we'll consider them putting something in next time (not a full buy-in) but something to let them realize they have to give to get...
Click to expand...
These are kids. The "buy in" could be anything. Like pooper scooper duty in the yard if they have a dog, or helping with washing the dinner dishes, or whatever their parents would like to see them do. I have no clue how schools are functioning since my youngest just turned 20, but report card grades could determine starting stack size. Anything can be used for a buy in with kids.
 
mtl mile end said:
Make a regular blind structure, aiming for two hours, with one rebuy each. I doubt it will go longer than an hour.
Click to expand...
So I considered rebuys, but I felt it would contribute to the all-in insanity.

Two hours... I don't think they can stay focused that long. That's why I made them 10 minutes.
 
BearMetal said:
So I considered rebuys, but I felt it would contribute to the all-in insanity.

Two hours... I don't think they can stay focused that long. That's why I made them 10 minutes.
Click to expand...
I was suggesting that if you created an expected two hour structure, it would probably end in less than an hour.

So without rebuys, if you are aiming at an hour for a normal (semi-sane adult) tourney, the starting stacks should be equal to about half the Big Blind at the one hour mark. I'm not familiar with Poker Mavens, but isn't there something "built-in" to create tourneys of "X" length of time with "Y" blind level length?
 
I wanted to follow-up here. The tournament was a huge success; thanks for all the feedback and ideas. I did eventually push it to 2 hours with 20 minute blinds. It gave them all plenty of time get hands and recover from bad moves. Final options were:

Deep stack (10,000 chips) with 20-minute blinds; no rebuys:
  • 10/20
  • 25/50
  • 100/200
  • 500/1000
  • 1000/2000
  • 5000/10000
 
Oh, and, of course, "The River Fucker" ... little bastards kept hitting great hands on the river...
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account and join our community. It's easy!

Register

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Similar threads

C
Tourney Help me design a 10-Player Tournament Structure
Replies
8
Views
320
CallingStation614
C
JesusMessiah777
Tourney Question: How many chips should each player have to start a home game?
Replies
4
Views
385
Taghkanic
Taghkanic
Anthony Martino
Tourney How Is This Turbo Structure For 3-Hour Sorority Tournament?
Replies
29
Views
913
JustinInMN
JustinInMN
renegadegatorman
Tourney Single table payout structure.
Replies
10
Views
541
TexRex
TexRex
T
Tourney Home Tournament Setup Help
Replies
13
Views
931
tooth_doc
tooth_doc
Back
Top Bottom